It is currently Sun 04 Oct 2026 6:50 pm

All times are UTC


Forum rules


Please click here to view the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov 2013 8:24 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 2114
Location: 91 - France
There's also the Fuaimeanna website (and the book, that I'll have to get round to buying of one of these days)
Here are the Cainteoirí -
www.fuaimeanna.ie/ga/Speakers.aspx


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov 2013 9:14 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed 24 Jul 2013 2:31 am
Posts: 329
franc 91 wrote:
There's also the Fuaimeanna website (and the book, that I'll have to get round to buying of one of these days)
Here are the Cainteoirí -
http://www.fuaimeanna.ie/ga/Speakers.aspx


Yes, great resource and great speakers.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov 2013 10:36 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat 01 Jun 2013 8:46 pm
Posts: 466
Im fairly sure the version on cork Irish is corrected ( could still be the odd misprint thought) .
Its located on this page, you have to scroll down to the comments section http://corkirish.wordpress.com/why-cork-irish/

When I cant find a word pronounced in Forvo in the dialect I want, I just use one of the Connemara speakers , it might not be the same, but its natural Irish. Otherwise I end up pronouncing the words like I did in school,with English phonetics and end up way off the mark.

e.g. ciste, instead of císte. I dont think fada's were really followed in my school.

Id forgotten about that Fuaimeanna website, anyone seen the book? is it any good.

_________________
Bíonn rudaí maithe mall


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov 2013 3:48 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat 18 Aug 2012 11:43 pm
Posts: 723
Location: Nua Mheicsiceo
According to the note at the bottom of the Fuaimeanna na Gaeilge page that describes the book:

"Note. Although this website is bilingual in Irish and English, the book itself is in Irish only."

I don't know why they always decide to do things this way. :( For me, it's not much help to try to learn about a new language from a book that is written in the language that I am trying to learn – I have a hard enough time understanding grammatical and phonetic explanations in English!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov 2013 5:43 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed 24 Jul 2013 2:31 am
Posts: 329
WeeFalorieMan wrote:
According to the note at the bottom of the Fuaimeanna na Gaeilge page that describes the book:

"Note. Although this website is bilingual in Irish and English, the book itself is in Irish only."

I don't know why they always decide to do things this way. :( For me, it's not much help to try to learn about a new language from a book that is written in the language that I am trying to learn – I have a hard enough time understanding grammatical and phonetic explanations in English!


Weefalorieman, textbooks aimed at learners should be in English - these things are all put into Irish as a kind of "achievement of the language movement", regardless of the impact on learners. Gaeilge Chorca Dhuibhne - all in Irish, and all in CO Irish - so clearly the message is that they want you to learn the CO, not any dialect. Stair na Gaeilge - if you're interested in the history of Munster Irish, you'd better read the CO. Even things like Gnás na Gaedhilge - it's the same thing - a good book on Syntax, in Irish for those speak enough Irish to not need such a book. The longer version of the Christian Brother's Grammar - in Irish for those who already have mastered the CO. Books like Séadna - produced with a long introduction in CO Irish, just in case anyone is reading the book hoping to learn Munster Irish...

I think they forgot about teaching Irish a long time ago. It's become a private little club for the professors who speak fluent Irish and like to produce their "in" material for themselves. Even things like Scéal mo Bheatha by Dónall Bán - you guessed it - the glossary is Irish-Irish. For example the entry describing fuíoll in that glossary says:

fuíoll = farasbarr. Fuíoll bruitíní .i. lagachar croí nú cléibh ' fhanfadh ar dhuine t'réis éagruais na bruitíní do chur de.

Got it?

[Fuíoll = "residue". Oddly enough glossed as farasbarr, which seems a rarer word than fuíoll!!!!!! Fuíoll bruitíní - the after-effects of the measles.]


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov 2013 7:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat 01 Jun 2013 8:46 pm
Posts: 466
I wonder would there be the demand for a decent enough course ( say basic 2,000 words ?) with audio, which is then just changed for each dialect.

There must be at least some demand in materials for dialects since they produce books of dialects once you already know CO Irish.

_________________
Bíonn rudaí maithe mall


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov 2013 10:56 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat 18 Aug 2012 11:43 pm
Posts: 723
Location: Nua Mheicsiceo
patrickjwalsh wrote:
Weefalorieman, textbooks aimed at learners should be in English - these things are all put into Irish as a kind of "achievement of the language movement", regardless of the impact on learners. Gaeilge Chorca Dhuibhne - all in Irish, and all in CO Irish - so clearly the message is that they want you to learn the CO, not any dialect. Stair na Gaeilge - if you're interested in the history of Munster Irish, you'd better read the CO. Even things like Gnás na Gaedhilge - it's the same thing - a good book on Syntax, in Irish for those speak enough Irish to not need such a book. The longer version of the Christian Brother's Grammar - in Irish for those who already have mastered the CO. Books like Séadna - produced with a long introduction in CO Irish, just in case anyone is reading the book hoping to learn Munster Irish...
Ah, now I see why there are virtually no learning materials in English for someone who is trying to learn Munster Irish – only books written entirely in Irish for people who, apparently, can already read and write proficiently in Irish!

patrickjwalsh wrote:
I think they forgot about teaching Irish a long time ago. It's become a private little club for the professors who speak fluent Irish and like to produce their "in" material for themselves. Even things like Scéal mo Bheatha by Dónall Bán - you guessed it - the glossary is Irish-Irish. For example the entry describing fuíoll in that glossary says:

fuíoll = farasbarr. Fuíoll bruitíní .i. lagachar croí nú cléibh ' fhanfadh ar dhuine t'réis éagruais na bruitíní do chur de.

Got it?

[Fuíoll = "residue". Oddly enough glossed as farasbarr, which seems a rarer word than fuíoll!!!!!! Fuíoll bruitíní - the after-effects of the measles.]
Hah, that is a hilarious example that illustrates your point very well!

Dáithí Mac Giolla. wrote:
I wonder would there be the demand for a decent enough course ( say basic 2,000 words ?) with audio, which is then just changed for each dialect.

There must be at least some demand in materials for dialects since they produce books of dialects once you already know CO Irish.
If there were learning materials in Munster Irish, people would use them. "Learning Irish" by Mícheál Ó Siadhail is probably (in my opinion) the most tedious boring book ever written in the history of the Earth, but people bought it and tried their best to learn from it because, for many years, there was pretty much nothing else out there for people who wanted to learn actual Gaeltacht Irish. The people who make Irish language courses deliberately choose to teach "standard" instead of an actual living spoken dialect of Irish; for reasons that are beyond my understanding, they consider "standard" more worthy of being taught.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sun 17 Nov 2013 4:32 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun 28 Aug 2011 8:29 pm
Posts: 3002
Maybe the problem is that there is not enough demand for regional dialects.
People start with the Caighdeánach or Urban Irish, a lot of those not aware of the differences. The people interested in regional dialects are often those who are proficient in Irish already, and are often interested in linguistics.

_________________
___________________________________________________________

It is recommended that you always wait for three to agree on a translation.
I speak Connemara Irish, and my input will often reflect that.
I will do an mp3 file on request for short translations.

___________________________________________________________


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sun 17 Nov 2013 5:57 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat 18 Aug 2012 11:43 pm
Posts: 723
Location: Nua Mheicsiceo
Bríd Mhór wrote:
Maybe the problem is that there is not enough demand for regional dialects.
People start with the Caighdeánach or Urban Irish, a lot of those not aware of the differences. The people interested in regional dialects are often those who are proficient in Irish already, and are often interested in linguistics.
I think you're right about this, since you're talking about Irish people who learnt "standard" in school – in Ireland. I assume that they spent their childhood learning what they believed to be "correct" Irish and are sometimes not aware of, or don't care to learn, spoken regional dialects.

I think the opposite is probably true for people outside of Ireland. If good learning materials for regional dialects existed, I think most learners would prefer those rather than learning "standard".


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dia duit....
PostPosted: Sun 17 Nov 2013 9:59 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 2114
Location: 91 - France
Well Gaschaint is in three dialects, for Bunghaeilge do Thuismitheoirí agus Feighlithe Leanaí, you have a different CD for each dialect including CO (if you want it), the Oidhreacht Corca Dhuibhne children's books and CDs are in their dialect and I would have thought that Taghd Mac Dhonnagáin would be speaking and singing in his own dialect rather than CO and then there's Cló Maigh Eo.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 1488 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group